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#26 2017-04-11 10:31:16

krazykarguy
Worst ninja editor, ever.
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From: South Carolina
Registered: 2007-04-06
User Number: 1944
Posts: 8203

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

So I get to pull this steaming pile of shit out of our Sorento at the end of the week. I can't wait. A discount is nice - but I hate driving the car knowing it's there.

My wife has not made any attempts to adjust her driving style, and still brakes far too late. All but a handful of the dings against us are her driving unamused. As of right now, we still have a 17% discount, which strangely has not changed since about a week after my last post (despite 13 'events' and 1000 miles since then) . It's like the review period was really only 45 days, and the last 45 days are irrelevant.

The device has registered 29 hard braking events and 3 rapid acceleration events over the last 3,518 miles, meaning a per 100 mile rate of 0.68 and 0.09 respectively.

Not looking forward to having it on my Mustang, but at least she's not driving it - and I know to be on my best behavior at the beginning.


2005 Aero 5MT
2014 Ford Mustang GT Premium 6MT - Sterling Gray Metallic

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#27 2017-04-21 12:39:02

Bryan
why don't you remember my name?
Supporter
From: Western WI
Registered: 2007-01-14
User Number: 1768
Posts: 10184

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

Oh man it might be worth getting one of these to finally settle the argument that my gf needs some advanced driver training....


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#28 2017-04-21 13:35:22

krazykarguy
Worst ninja editor, ever.
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From: South Carolina
Registered: 2007-04-06
User Number: 1944
Posts: 8203

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

arrow-up Even if you can prove it with data, she won't believe it. My wife would go crazy when I told her about a notification of an 'event'.

Every time I got one while I was driving, I knew that it would appear - especially the braking ones (i.e. traffic backed up suddenly and required >7mph/second decel).


2005 Aero 5MT
2014 Ford Mustang GT Premium 6MT - Sterling Gray Metallic

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#29 2017-06-12 14:05:27

krazykarguy
Worst ninja editor, ever.
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From: South Carolina
Registered: 2007-04-06
User Number: 1944
Posts: 8203

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

So as a follow-up, we ended up with a 17% discount. I now have it installed in my Mustang.

With 420 horsepower and 3.73:1 rear gears it is barely possible to get going slowly. I have to start in 2nd gear on a flat surface, otherwise I risk a 'hard acceleration'.  It's stupidly sensitive, and a week and a half into this, I already have three.  unamused unamused unamused

I also have a couple of 'hard braking' events, both a result of another driver pulling some stupid shit in front of me. How this becomes a relevant way to judge MY driving is beyond ridiculous.


2005 Aero 5MT
2014 Ford Mustang GT Premium 6MT - Sterling Gray Metallic

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#30 2017-06-12 15:23:29

snowphun
Member
From: Central CT
Registered: 2005-11-09
User Number: 890
Posts: 264

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

I went through this on all our cars for Progressive, one car was in the garage on jack stands most of the time, the others I avoided driving as much as possible. It's a frustrating tool that doesn't reward good driving, just unreasonably slow braking and acceleration.

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#31 2017-06-17 15:40:34

straytowel
Member
From: CT
Registered: 2009-06-04
User Number: 3742
Posts: 1635

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

krazykarguy wrote:

The device has registered 29 hard braking events and 3 rapid acceleration events over the last 3,518 miles, meaning a per 100 mile rate of 0.68 and 0.09 respectively.

Does the incident per mile ratio really matter? I just put one of these on my girlfriend's car and she has a 1 mile inner city commute and walks most of the time, so she barely drives maybe 200 miles a month. She's had it for a few days and already racked up about 5 hard braking events.


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#32 2017-06-17 18:21:55

snowphun
Member
From: Central CT
Registered: 2005-11-09
User Number: 890
Posts: 264

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

Yeah, she's hosed. How else are they going to interpret the data? Get the car out for some mellow highway driving. I left it unplugged if I want to bomb around.

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#33 Yesterday 15:15:29

krazykarguy
Worst ninja editor, ever.
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From: South Carolina
Registered: 2007-04-06
User Number: 1944
Posts: 8203

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

FUCK. THIS. THING.  mad

14 'events' in 24 days so far on the Mustang.

Unplugging the monitor is essentially stating that "I quit, you can take your 5% 'safe driving and participation in the program discount' and shove it up your corporate overlord's ass", so that's out.

Most frustrating is that I got hit with THREE 'rapid acceleration' events yesterday FOR THE SAME FUCKING ACCELERATION event (highway onramp). I literally turned onto the freeway and stomped on it until I was moving the same speed as traffic.

Event 4    06/21/17, 10:35 AM    1.0 seconds    11.2 - 18.6mph
Event 5    06/21/17, 10:35 AM    1.0 seconds    22.4 - 37.3mph
Event 6    06/21/17, 10:35 AM    2.0 seconds    55.9 - 70.8mph

How fucking stupid is that?!? Especially when you are trying for a discount based on the "number of events per 100 miles"??? Instead of ONE event, I get THREE. It should be one 6-7 second event from 11.2 - 70.8 mph, right?? unamused

I've driven over 600 miles so far, and it's insane trying to granny-start this car to avoid getting pinged. You cannot do anything about the hard braking - if you have an asshole pull out in front of you or suddenly take the 'safe space' in between you and the car in front of you, you cannot avoid it.


2005 Aero 5MT
2014 Ford Mustang GT Premium 6MT - Sterling Gray Metallic

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#34 Yesterday 15:49:20

drewsro
Why Am I Still Here?
From: NW Indiana
Registered: 2014-01-10
User Number: 13600
Posts: 1396

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

That's why those things are dumb.  Meant for old people lol


2005 9-2x Aero 5MT- Stage 2
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#35 Today 11:43:37

krazykarguy
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From: South Carolina
Registered: 2007-04-06
User Number: 1944
Posts: 8203

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

I inquired as to why it gave me three separate events instead of just one. My primary concern was the triple infraction, but also that my discount STARTED at 23% (not the 30% that the other car started at, therefore an automatic -7% discount possible) I got this form letter in reply:

Good Morning,



During the 90 day evaluation period the device will track quick starts, hard stops, time of day, and mileage. The device is unable to determine who is driving, and all drivers will collect the same data.



The RightTrack device uses a sensitive threshold for measuring change in speed per second. If the maximum change in speed is 7 or 8 MPH per second that will result in an acceleration or braking event. While that may seem overly conservative, and all drivers in the program are expected to generate some events, these sensitive thresholds are designed to produce a more individualized pattern and evaluation of driving style.



The device communicates directly with the vehicle's on-board computer and uses second-by-second data from the Vehicle Speed Sensor to determine all acceleration and braking events. This is the same sensor and data used by the vehicle's speedometer, making the data as accurate as the speed displayed in the vehicle. The device will also track for night time driving from 12-4 am as well as low mileage. Every mile driven will count against the score. We know there are times when the safe driving response is to accelerate or decelerate rapidly to avoid a crash. By setting a sensitive threshold, itís easier for us to see the pattern of how someone normally drives.



The score is based off of an average of events per 100 miles, so the score can fluctuate and change throughout the evaluation period. This is also designed this way to help against situations you cannot control such as people pulling out in front of you or animals running out in front of you. By completing the 90 days you are guaranteed at least a 5% discount off of the basic vehicle coverageís per vehicle enrolled.



Please let us know if you have any questions.


All of this stuff is more or less verbatim what is found on the Liberty Mutual/SafeCo websites. I know quite well how the program works, how about you read my e-mail/concerns and ANSWER THEM?  mad


2005 Aero 5MT
2014 Ford Mustang GT Premium 6MT - Sterling Gray Metallic

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#36 Today 14:25:12

cjaama
Member
From: albany, ny
Registered: 2007-03-09
User Number: 1885
Posts: 1009

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

krazykarguy wrote:

I inquired as to why it gave me three separate events instead of just one. My primary concern was the triple infraction, but also that my discount STARTED at 23% (not the 30% that the other car started at, therefore an automatic -7% discount possible) I got this form letter in reply:

Good Morning,



During the 90 day evaluation period the device will track quick starts, hard stops, time of day, and mileage. The device is unable to determine who is driving, and all drivers will collect the same data.



The RightTrack device uses a sensitive threshold for measuring change in speed per second. If the maximum change in speed is 7 or 8 MPH per second that will result in an acceleration or braking event. While that may seem overly conservative, and all drivers in the program are expected to generate some events, these sensitive thresholds are designed to produce a more individualized pattern and evaluation of driving style.



The device communicates directly with the vehicle's on-board computer and uses second-by-second data from the Vehicle Speed Sensor to determine all acceleration and braking events. This is the same sensor and data used by the vehicle's speedometer, making the data as accurate as the speed displayed in the vehicle. The device will also track for night time driving from 12-4 am as well as low mileage. Every mile driven will count against the score. We know there are times when the safe driving response is to accelerate or decelerate rapidly to avoid a crash. By setting a sensitive threshold, itís easier for us to see the pattern of how someone normally drives.



The score is based off of an average of events per 100 miles, so the score can fluctuate and change throughout the evaluation period. This is also designed this way to help against situations you cannot control such as people pulling out in front of you or animals running out in front of you. By completing the 90 days you are guaranteed at least a 5% discount off of the basic vehicle coverageís per vehicle enrolled.



Please let us know if you have any questions.


All of this stuff is more or less verbatim what is found on the Liberty Mutual/SafeCo websites. I know quite well how the program works, how about you read my e-mail/concerns and ANSWER THEM?  mad

You'll never get anything but an automatic generic response regarding this.  My guess is you get dinged for every second you remain at WOT...or at least whatever they determine is a hard acceleration.


'05 Desert Sand Aero> '96 Volvo 850> '13 Passat> '16 Chevy Volt/'97 Wrangler

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#37 Today 15:00:00

krazykarguy
Worst ninja editor, ever.
Supporter
From: South Carolina
Registered: 2007-04-06
User Number: 1944
Posts: 8203

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

arrow-up If that was the case, every single highway trip would have resulted in a ding, as I would typically leave it in 6th and go WOT to pass. But thanks for the confirmation that this is a typical corporate brushoff. I replied back, asking for answers earlier this morning without a response yet.

This form letter essentially states that the VSS feed to the ECU is being used to determine speed deltas.

The thing that really bugs me is the count of 'infractions' on Wednesday and the fact that your discount is based on these counts. More counts equals less discount, so I guess it makes sense that they want to get me thrice instead of just once. Feels pretty scammy to me...  hmm


2005 Aero 5MT
2014 Ford Mustang GT Premium 6MT - Sterling Gray Metallic

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#38 Today 15:03:58

snowphun
Member
From: Central CT
Registered: 2005-11-09
User Number: 890
Posts: 264

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

I agree with their logic, it's riskier to romp from 20-80 mph than it is to rapidly accelerate for a small portion of that range.  You've volunteered to play in their silly game, understand the rules and bend them to your favor. Pull the unit if you want to romp on the car, plug it in for long mellow drives to build up some good miles. I got the biggest discount on the car that was on blocks in the garage for most of the evaluation period, how does that make any sense? These evals will get much more sophisticated in coming years.

As others have pointed out my substantial % discounts amounted to just a few dollars off my next renewal.

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#39 Today 16:36:24

krazykarguy
Worst ninja editor, ever.
Supporter
From: South Carolina
Registered: 2007-04-06
User Number: 1944
Posts: 8203

Re: Insurance company driving monitors

arrow-up Pulling the unit from the OBD port essentially tells SafeCo, "I voluntarily terminate the discount program". Maybe your monitor was different, but that's not an option with mine.

I have found out that the discount only applies to the basic portion of the insurance bill, it's not applied to other parts of the premium. It might not be worth worrying about anymore at 13% now. If it falls below 10% I'm just going to drive the piss out of the car and see just how very bad I can get it to go.  biggrin


2005 Aero 5MT
2014 Ford Mustang GT Premium 6MT - Sterling Gray Metallic

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